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Jessica Knoch

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Since: Aug 20, 2003
Posts: 3



(Msg. 1) Posted: Wed Aug 20, 2003 6:52 pm
Post subject: "Which breed is right for us" Challenge
Archived from groups: rec>pets>dogs>breeds (more info?)

Hello, group. My husband Carl and I are starting to shop for breeds,
and I'm trying to make use of all the tools available so I thought I
would ask here and see what people said. It's a classic game of
"Which breed is right for us?" Not worried about anything else; just
choosing a breed at this point.

First, small dogs are right out. Time-consuming-to-groom dogs are
right out. We have three cats (one a bit unfriendly) and no children
currently, although that will probably change in a few years. We are
pretty active, and I would like to take the dog on short runs (1-2
mi a day) and maybe the weekly longer run at about four miles. At
the same time, we have other hobbies that occasionally take us away
for a long day or a weekend, and can't bring the dog with us.

We have a good-sized house and a good-sized back yard, which will be
fenced. Carl likes the hefty look of a Mastiff or (to a lesser
degree) Greater Swiss Mountain Dog. Personally, I like the body
style of a Flat-Coated Retriever, but Carl thinks they are not
stocky enough. There is no upper limit on size.

We are especially interested in having an intelligent dog who will
be part of the family, with very low grooming requirements and
preferably minimal shedding. But, neither of us has much experience
bringing up a dog properly. Ideally, the breed would also be good at
agility and obedience type stuff, in case we go further in the hobby
later on.

So, what do you all think? Our top runners right now are the
Mastiff, the GSMD, and the Canaan Dog, although I still like the FCR
too.

Thanks for replies,
Jessica Knoch

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Karen DuChateaux

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Since: Aug 20, 2003
Posts: 6



(Msg. 2) Posted: Wed Aug 20, 2003 7:43 pm
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Jessica Knoch wrote:

> Hello, group. My husband Carl and I are starting to shop for breeds,
> and I'm trying to make use of all the tools available so I thought I
> would ask here and see what people said. It's a classic game of
> "Which breed is right for us?" Not worried about anything else; just
> choosing a breed at this point.
>
> First, small dogs are right out. Time-consuming-to-groom dogs are
> right out. We have three cats (one a bit unfriendly) and no children
> currently, although that will probably change in a few years. We are
> pretty active, and I would like to take the dog on short runs (1-2
> mi a day) and maybe the weekly longer run at about four miles. At
> the same time, we have other hobbies that occasionally take us away
> for a long day or a weekend, and can't bring the dog with us.
>
> We have a good-sized house and a good-sized back yard, which will be
> fenced. Carl likes the hefty look of a Mastiff or (to a lesser
> degree) Greater Swiss Mountain Dog. Personally, I like the body
> style of a Flat-Coated Retriever, but Carl thinks they are not
> stocky enough. There is no upper limit on size.
>
> We are especially interested in having an intelligent dog who will
> be part of the family, with very low grooming requirements and
> preferably minimal shedding. But, neither of us has much experience
> bringing up a dog properly. Ideally, the breed would also be good at
> agility and obedience type stuff, in case we go further in the hobby
> later on.
>
> So, what do you all think? Our top runners right now are the
> Mastiff, the GSMD, and the Canaan Dog, although I still like the FCR
> too.
>
> Thanks for replies,
> Jessica Knoch

I can't imagine that you will find any one breed that meets all your
specs. Big and blocky are not necessarily fast or agile. Some big dogs
are fast - IWs, Borzoi, Scottish deerhounds - and agile for their size,
but not for agility trials. They aren't blocky, either. And they are
intelligent, but their own interests are much more interesting to them
than the owners'. If you think agility will be a likely sport for you,
go to some trials and see what's running.

The biggest and most substantial in build I can think of that would
enjoy running with you would be retrievers, and they'd love to be part
of the family, but they aren't BIG dogs.

One thing you might want to keep in mind along with everything else is
that the bigger the breed, the longer it takes to mature and the shorter
it's average lifespan. The giant dogs just don't live as long as the
smaller to medium size dogs. If you had an IW that lived to be 10, you'd
have a rarity, while my 20 year old toy poodle is still chugging happily
along. I have to admit she's nearly blind and deaf, but her sniffer
works great and she has no health problems otherwise.

[karibear]

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Robin Nuttall

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Since: Aug 07, 2003
Posts: 21



(Msg. 3) Posted: Wed Aug 20, 2003 8:11 pm
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>
> So, what do you all think? Our top runners right now are the
> Mastiff, the GSMD, and the Canaan Dog, although I still like the FCR
> too.
>

The mastiff is going to not be a good agility dog. Short haired, but also
not a good jogging partner. I can't fit a single thing about a mastiff to
your criteria other than "big and stocky." They slobber massively, and are
just to heavy to do well at anything athletic.

Swissies are very rare. A better choice as athlete, but a good one may be
very difficult to find. I still would call them too big to make a really
good jogging or agility partner.

Canaan dogs aren't big at all. Much smaller. Very aloof, can be difficult to
train--likely to have their own agenda and not be too concerned about
whether it meshes with yours. Excellent athletes.

Flatcoats are a true challenge. Lovely dogs, but extremely high energy and
can be very difficult. They don't really mean to be, but they can take
hardheadedness to a whole new level. Lots of hair. Fantastic athletes.

I don't know about Canaans, but the other 3 breeds are prone to a lot of
health problems. None are necessarily going to live much past 6 or
7--Mastiffs have a lot of hip and elbow dysplasia, and Swissies and Flatties
both have a real problem with cancer.

If you want "stocky" you might try a staffy bull, a Rottweiler, an Am
Staff/Pit bull, or other type of bully breed. They tend to be stocky. Avoid
dogs which are too brachycephalic, that leads to breathing problems. And of
course with all purebreds it is very important to do a lot of research on
breeders and get a dog from generations of dogs with recorded results of
genetic health testing.
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WhansaMi

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Since: Dec 14, 2004
Posts: 9



(Msg. 4) Posted: Wed Aug 20, 2003 10:05 pm
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Jessica, I get the sense that you are focussing too much on the appearance of
the various breeds than the temperament traits on the breeds. I'd suggest that
you spend some time looking at what these breeds were bred for, and see if
their *function* and temperament fits in with what you are looking for.

Sheila
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Jessica Knoch

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Since: Aug 21, 2003
Posts: 2



(Msg. 5) Posted: Thu Aug 21, 2003 1:21 am
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"WhansaMi" <whansami.RemoveThis@aol.com> wrote...
> Jessica, I get the sense that you are focussing too much on the appearance
of
> the various breeds than the temperament traits on the breeds. I'd suggest
that
> you spend some time looking at what these breeds were bred for, and see if
> their *function* and temperament fits in with what you are looking for.

We *have* narrowed it down to five from over 150 based on temperament and
some
other things, including size. I guess I'm asking the wrong questions.

--
Jess K.
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Jessica Knoch

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Since: Aug 21, 2003
Posts: 2



(Msg. 6) Posted: Thu Aug 21, 2003 1:23 am
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"Robin Nuttall" <robinjn RemoveThis @mchsi.com> wrote...
>
> >
> > So, what do you all think? Our top runners right now are the
> > Mastiff, the GSMD, and the Canaan Dog, although I still like the FCR
> > too.
>
> I don't know about Canaans, but the other 3 breeds are prone to a lot of
> health problems. None are necessarily going to live much past 6 or
> 7--Mastiffs have a lot of hip and elbow dysplasia, and Swissies and
Flatties
> both have a real problem with cancer.

Thanks Robin -- these are very important considerations. I don't think
we'll get everything we want from a dog in just one breed, so we'll
probably end up with more than one breed over the years. I appreciate
your answer.

--
Jessica
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culprit

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Since: Aug 20, 2003
Posts: 56



(Msg. 7) Posted: Thu Aug 21, 2003 11:05 am
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"Jessica Knoch" <jessicaknoch.TakeThisOut@mindspring.com> wrote in message
news:QrP0b.2722$sV.2560@newsread1.news.atl.earthlink.net...
> Hello, group. My husband Carl and I are starting to shop for breeds,
> and I'm trying to make use of all the tools available so I thought I
> would ask here and see what people said. It's a classic game of
> "Which breed is right for us?" Not worried about anything else; just
> choosing a breed at this point.

have you thought about the smaller mastiff cousins? and American
Staffordshire Terrier or Boxer would make good running partners, but also
have some of the blocky Mastiff look to them. they're both very trainable
and both have been known to do agility.

-kelly
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Tara O.

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Since: Aug 20, 2003
Posts: 83



(Msg. 8) Posted: Fri Aug 22, 2003 8:05 am
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> Alot of Boxers do amazingly well with jobbing believe it or not.

Um, that would be "jogging"

--
Tara
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Diana

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Since: Sep 10, 2003
Posts: 97



(Msg. 9) Posted: Fri Aug 22, 2003 9:09 am
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"Jessica Knoch" <jessicaknoch.TakeThisOut@mindspring.com> wrote in message
news:QrP0b.2722$sV.2560@newsread1.news.atl.earthlink.net...
> Hello, group. My husband Carl and I are starting to shop for breeds,
> and I'm trying to make use of all the tools available so I thought I
> would ask here and see what people said. It's a classic game of
> "Which breed is right for us?" Not worried about anything else; just
> choosing a breed at this point.
>

As well as you requirements, some breeds are more demanding and more
attached to their people than others too. You don't say how many hours a day
the dog will be on his or her own, which IMO is a huge consideration.... but
if you are in for a substantial part of the day ~ as in working from home or
a stay at home parent, have you considered the Weimaraner or Viszla?

Both will enjoy the exercise, both are powerful and intelligent, both have
minimal coat care requirements though both will need careful introducing to
your cats. The Viszla is slightly smaller and a little more biddable where
the Weim is more wilful. Both can create one heck of a din and destroy a
house in no time if left alone for long, and so are breeds with which you
must be very honest with yourself and be prepared to be flexible to give
them what they need.... time and training, time and training and more time
and training.

but now with more experience from the weim side, you really can't get a more
loving breed.

Diana
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Diana

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Since: Sep 10, 2003
Posts: 97



(Msg. 10) Posted: Fri Aug 22, 2003 11:18 am
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"Jessica Knoch" <jessicaknoch DeleteThis @mindspring.com> wrote in message
news:QrP0b.2722$sV.2560@newsread1.news.atl.earthlink.net...
> Hello, group. My husband Carl and I are starting to shop for breeds,
> and I'm trying to make use of all the tools available so I thought I
> would ask here and see what people said. It's a classic game of
> "Which breed is right for us?" Not worried about anything else; just
> choosing a breed at this point.
>

Though thinking about it, might not the dalmation be a good choice?
They moult fairly heavily but that's 'fixable' with a quick brush over. They
were born to jog and I believe they might be a little more independant than
the other two I mentioned.

Diana
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Jessica Knoch

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Since: Aug 20, 2003
Posts: 3



(Msg. 11) Posted: Fri Aug 22, 2003 12:27 pm
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Diana wrote:
> As well as you requirements, some breeds are more demanding and
> more attached to their people than others too. You don't say how
> many hours a day the dog will be on his or her own, which IMO is
> a huge consideration.... but if you are in for a substantial part
> of the day ~ as in working from home or a stay at home parent,
> have you considered the Weimaraner or Viszla?
>
> Diana

These are great ideas. My husband does work at home, but we would
need a serious chat about how much distraction he might put up with
:-). I will have to look closer at these breeds! Also, the Dalmatian
was one of my top-runners (no pun intended) a while back; I was a
bit worried about health problems, like deafness, with Dals,
especially since we might have kids in a few years.

Thanks,

--
Jess K.
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onewaits

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Since: Mar 14, 2006
Posts: 88



(Msg. 12) Posted: Sun Aug 24, 2003 2:08 am
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When the ancient war dogs did battle on Wed, 20 Aug 2003 20:11:08 GMT,
"Robin Nuttall" <robinjn.RemoveThis@mchsi.com> did speak the following bit of
wisdom:

>If you want "stocky" you might try a staffy bull, a Rottweiler, an Am
>Staff/Pit bull, or other type of bully breed.

I thought of Rotties right away. But the OP stated "neither of us has
much experience bringing up a dog properly" and the Rottweiler isn't
an ideal breed for inexperienced owners, IME. Don't know how Am.
Staffs (APBTs) would be in that respect. I wonder if Staffy Bulls
would be able to do all the running they were talking about. ???

*~ *~ *~
Karen C.
Spammers be damned! I can't be emailed from this account! So there...

"You have no power here!
...Be gone! Before somebody drops a house on you too!"
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Rocky

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Since: Aug 20, 2003
Posts: 128



(Msg. 13) Posted: Sun Aug 24, 2003 2:20 am
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Karen said in rec.pets.dogs.breeds:

> I wonder if Staffy Bulls
> would be able to do all the running they were talking
> about. ???

Granted, I only know one, but no. Plus, a Staffy Bull is
getting away from their large dog requirement.

I can't think of the right breed for them. So what I'd do is
what others have suggested - hang out at the pound. The perfect
dog will come along quickly, I think.

--
--Matt. Rocky's a Dog.
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Blasjj

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Since: Jun 22, 2003
Posts: 18



(Msg. 14) Posted: Mon Aug 25, 2003 7:02 pm
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Won't matter as long as you get one from OFAed EXCELLENT or GOOD parents..
along with elbows OFAed if possible.. owning a Rott, German Shepherd,
American Stafford.. may scare your neighbors... when a Terrier (cannot STAND
Terriers) bites at you, some of their clueless owners think it's "cute..."
but if a Rott snaps at someone, next thing you know you're "branded" by the
entire neighborhood..

A hunting breed will chase.. a working dog will demand exercise, or will
tear your house apart..

Mastiffs have LOADS (LOADS) of health problems and don't live long...
Greater Swiss.. are quite rare and will be expensive, if you can even find
one in your region, much less area.. Flat Retrievers are gorgeous, easily
trained.. everyone has an opinion.. it's important to visit the dogs'
parents and see for yourself their temperament.. the breed sometimes
determines temperament and there's little you can do.. but usually you can
tell temperament from SEVERAL visits.. It's important to go to a breeder
that does epitomize the movie "Best in Show.." and believe that in itself is
a tough one.. there's nothing quite like dealing with certain breeders that
can't relate to people well.. lectures, lectures, more lectures.. not all
breeders are this way, but steer clear of the ones that are..

So, best to you.. you'll find the right dog, if you take the time.. so many
variables, and so much luck as well!!!
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Blasjj

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Since: Jun 22, 2003
Posts: 18



(Msg. 15) Posted: Mon Aug 25, 2003 7:04 pm
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does NOT epitomize the movie "Best in Show.."
"Blasjj" <asflkjawflkj RemoveThis @msn.com> wrote in message
news:bied15$54v$1@news.primary.net...
> Won't matter as long as you get one from OFAed EXCELLENT or GOOD parents..
> along with elbows OFAed if possible.. owning a Rott, German Shepherd,
> American Stafford.. may scare your neighbors... when a Terrier (cannot
STAND
> Terriers) bites at you, some of their clueless owners think it's "cute..."
> but if a Rott snaps at someone, next thing you know you're "branded" by
the
> entire neighborhood..
>
> A hunting breed will chase.. a working dog will demand exercise, or will
> tear your house apart..
>
> Mastiffs have LOADS (LOADS) of health problems and don't live long...
> Greater Swiss.. are quite rare and will be expensive, if you can even find
> one in your region, much less area.. Flat Retrievers are gorgeous, easily
> trained.. everyone has an opinion.. it's important to visit the dogs'
> parents and see for yourself their temperament.. the breed sometimes
> determines temperament and there's little you can do.. but usually you can
> tell temperament from SEVERAL visits.. It's important to go to a breeder
> that does epitomize the movie "Best in Show.." and believe that in itself
is
> a tough one.. there's nothing quite like dealing with certain breeders
that
> can't relate to people well.. lectures, lectures, more lectures.. not all
> breeders are this way, but steer clear of the ones that are..
>
> So, best to you.. you'll find the right dog, if you take the time.. so
many
> variables, and so much luck as well!!!
>
>
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