lLABRADOR RETRIEVER PUPPIES

Dale Atkin wrote:

> Also, are all these pups from the litter? If so, I have to say I'm rather
> surprised. There is only one particular crossing that I can think of that
> would yield Black, Yellow and Chocolate puppies, and certainly unlikely to
> be in those ratios (expected ratio 55% black pups, 25% yellow pups and 20%
> chocolate).

Hey, Dale, you might be getting a little carried away. There are lots
of possibilities that can produce all three colors. Both parents have
to be carriers of b and e (recessive chocolate and yellow), and one of
them has to be other than yellow. Also keep in mind that litters rarely
match predicted probabilities. Probabilities are more closely approached
when dealing with large numbers of whatever we're predicting...and the
seller mentioned that these are the puppies that are "left," suggesting
there are others in the litter we haven't heard about.

Black (carrying b and e) x Black (carrying b and e) gives
1/16 yellow with brown nose, 3/16 yellow with black nose, 3/16 chocolate,
9/16 black

Black (carrying b and e) x Chocolate (carrying yellow) gives
1/8 yellow with brown nose, 1/8 yellow with black nose, 3/8 choc,
3/8 black

Black (carrying b and e) x yellow with black nose (carrying choc) gives
1/8 yellow with brown nose, 1/8 chocolate, 3/8 yellow with black nose,
3/8 black.

Black (carrying b and e) x yellow with brown nose gives
1/4 black, 1/4 chocolate, 1/4 yellow with black nose, 1/4 yellow with
brown nose.

Yellow with black nose (carrying b) x chocolate (carrying e) gives
1/4 black, 1/4 chocolate, 1/4 yellow with black nose, 1/4 yellow with
brown nose.

I think that's it.

Amy Dahl
 >> Stay informed about: lLABRADOR RETRIEVER PUPPIES 

These puppy mills make me ill.


"jody" <j.shenk.TakeThisOut@charter.net> wrote in message
news:1153161918.878737.319580@m79g2000cwm.googlegroups.com...
>I GOT 6 LEFT TO Sell A.K.C. 250.00 plus shipping and handling-I am IN
> THE MADISON IL. AREA
> 1 male BLACK 1 male CHOCOLATE 1 yellow male 3 yellow females. ready in
> about 3 weeks.Have pic's- e-mail me at j.shenk.TakeThisOut@charter.net. awesome so
> cute. Mother has champions in her bloodline.
>
 >> Stay informed about: lLABRADOR RETRIEVER PUPPIES 

"Amy Dahl" <amy DeleteThis @oakhillkennel.com> wrote in message
news:44BCF54B.A5990CDF@oakhillkennel.com...
>
>
> Dale Atkin wrote:
>
>> Also, are all these pups from the litter? If so, I have to say I'm rather
>> surprised. There is only one particular crossing that I can think of that
>> would yield Black, Yellow and Chocolate puppies, and certainly unlikely
>> to
>> be in those ratios (expected ratio 55% black pups, 25% yellow pups and
>> 20%
>> chocolate).
>
> Hey, Dale, you might be getting a little carried away. There are lots
> of possibilities that can produce all three colors.

Well bit of a 'brain fart' on my part. Decided to take the easy way out and
look up the combinations on the web, rather than work them out for myself.
(never really particularly bothered to work out the genetics for myself, not
that they're complicated or anything, just haven't bothered to spend the
time)

> Both parents have
> to be carriers of b and e (recessive chocolate and yellow), and one of
> them has to be other than yellow. Also keep in mind that litters rarely
> match predicted probabilities. Probabilities are more closely approached
> when dealing with large numbers of whatever we're predicting...

Yeah, but those numbers are pretty far out from the predicted values. I
wouldn't expect a 1:1 correspondence, but I'd certainly expect more blacks
than anything else in the litter. Suppose I could do a Chi Square on the
numbers, and figure out the probability of these numbers arising by a chance
deviation, but I think you'd find the probability pretty low.

> and the
> seller mentioned that these are the puppies that are "left," suggesting
> there are others in the litter we haven't heard about.
>

True, but typically I think blacks are less 'fashionable' than the other
colours (at least in my experience), which would tend to put the numbers
further out of whack than what they seem at first glance.

I suppose a Chi-Square is in order to see how likely the various
combinations are....

> Black (carrying b and e) x Black (carrying b and e) gives
> 1/16 yellow with brown nose, 3/16 yellow with black nose, 3/16 chocolate,
> 9/16 black

5.3%...not that one.

> Black (carrying b and e) x Chocolate (carrying yellow) gives
> 1/8 yellow with brown nose, 1/8 yellow with black nose, 3/8 choc,
> 3/8 black

6.21%...not that one

> Black (carrying b and e) x yellow with black nose (carrying choc) gives
> 1/8 yellow with brown nose, 1/8 chocolate, 3/8 yellow with black nose,
> 3/8 black.

57.3%...could be that one

> Black (carrying b and e) x yellow with brown nose gives
> 1/4 black, 1/4 chocolate, 1/4 yellow with black nose, 1/4 yellow with
> brown nose.

71.6%...That's pretty likely

> Yellow with black nose (carrying b) x chocolate (carrying e) gives
> 1/4 black, 1/4 chocolate, 1/4 yellow with black nose, 1/4 yellow with
> brown nose.

71.6%...Could be that one too.

> I think that's it.
>
> Amy Dahl
>

Yeah that looks like maybe I did over react. Hadn't looked at those other
combinations.
Hey aren't those yellow with brown noses labs not 'desirable' as far as
genetic make up goes? Or am I just imagining things?

Dale
 >> Stay informed about: lLABRADOR RETRIEVER PUPPIES