Purrs for Tigger, please?

> For me, in the UK I have to ask a question, if you have to keep
> your cat in the house 24/7 why do you do it? and is this OK?

As we moved from a top-floor city city flat where the cats couldn't
go out to a terrace house in a middling-rural area where they could,
we have some experience with this. Some of our cats were obviously
much happier with the extra freedom, others didn't really care.

The biggest difference was with Muriel; she was about 9 when we
moved, had never lived anywhere except city flats, and as far as
we knew she didn't have a purr. She started purring a few weeks
after we moved. That tells me something.

Actually the cats could sort of go out in the city flat. We were
in a Georgian Edinburgh tenement with a windowledge that went all
the way along the block. One cat, Busby, figured this one out and
used to for night walks along the ledge (four floors up). At one
point he used to go into a neighbour's flat if the window was open,
pee in her houseplants and come back home. It took her months to
work out why her plants had started smelling of cat pee. Then one
day Busby went out of the window, I didn't realize he'd gone and
shut it, and he didn't come back the next morning. I presume
somebody further along the block must have adopted him, since if
he'd fallen off we'd have found him.

They were happiest when we had some building work done on the
sunny side of the block. There was scaffolding up for a few
months and the cats could sit outside and photosynthesize or
go and stare through the neighbours' windows. They were dead
miffed when it was taken away.

============== j-c ====== @ ====== purr . demon . co . uk ==============
Jack Campin: 11 Third St, Newtongrange EH22 4PU, Scotland | tel 0131 660 4760
<http://www.purr.demon.co.uk/jack/> for CD-ROMs and free | fax 0870 0554 975
stuff: Scottish music, food intolerance, & Mac logic fonts | mob 07800 739 557
 >> Stay informed about: Purrs for Tigger, please? 

"Stormmee" <rgrass.TakeThisOut@consolidated.net> wrote in message
news:5ocpgaFm5065U1@mid.individual.net...
> this isn't about demonizing, its about the laws that are on the books, and
> if you read them, nowhere is strict enough to suit me, but if you compare,
> actual crimes on the books, people charged/convicted and time/sentences
> they
> are more civilized. there are lots of wonderful people anywhere you care
> to
> look its just that most of the good people are busy trying to make a
> living
> instead of trying to change laws. Lee

Sorry, but no, you're wrong. The laws regarding animal abuse in Texas are
some of the strictest and the punishments the harshest in the world. It's a
felony here and you can do *hard time* for it. Texas is also one of the
very few places where a jury can award you monetary damages for "pain and
suffering" and the emotional harm caused by someone hurting or killing your
pet (most places will only award the cost of the animal and, sometimes, vet
bills).

I get tickled when Americans believe so fervently that people in the UK are
so much more civilized because they talk with a pretty accent and stick
their pinkies out when drinking tea. I'm not saying that they are any
*worse* than people in America, but neither are they any better. Remember
this....

Until quite recently in the UK, fox hunts were legal where hounds hunted
down and then tore apart foxes and the lead horseman was awarded the fox's
tail as a trophy.

The UK originated the punishment of "hanged, drawn and quartered": [The
full sentence passed upon those convicted of High Treason up to 1870 was as
follows : "That you be drawn on a hurdle to the place of execution where you
shall be hanged by the neck and being alive cut down, your privy members
shall be cut off and your bowels taken out and burned before you, your head
severed from your body and your body divided into four quarters to be
disposed of at the King's pleasure." So not for the faint-hearted then!!]
It was the US who originated the law against "cruel and unusual punishment".

I know there are good laws and bad laws on both sides of "the pond" as there
are good people and bad people both places too. But please don't try to
tell me that my country is any *more* savage or brutal than any other - it's
just *NOT TRUE*. And as an American, you should be ashamed of yourself for
thinking so!

Hugs,

CatNipped
 >> Stay informed about: Purrs for Tigger, please? 

On Oct 26, 8:39 am, Jack Campin - bogus address
<bo... DeleteThis @purr.demon.co.uk> wrote:
> > it appears that fox hunting is *still* legal in the UK. So the
> > country you're praising for being so much more civilized than
> > the US still allows packs of hounds to chase down for hours and
> > then tear apart foxes.
>
> It's been banned in Scotland for a few years now. There is no such
> thing as "UK" law - Scots and English/Welsh law have never been the
> same, and on issues like this they're increasingly diverging since
> the Scottish Parliament took responsibility for such matters north
> of the border.
>
> >http://www.mfha.org.uk/
>
> Given what that acronym stands for, I'm going to give the site a
> swerve just as I would a Texas snake-torturing site. It hadn't
> occurred to me that those ghouls would even know how to use the web.
> For sure *something* got banned in England a couple of years ago
> or that lot wouldn't have been staging demos about it.
>
> The problem both sides of the pond is more to do with the culture
> than the law. (Americans have an unfortunate tendency to assume
> that if a country has banned something it doesn't happen and if
> it's legal everybody must be doing it). The nastiest kinds of
> animal cruelty in the UK are livestock rearing (no worse than the
> rest of the world but no better either), hare coursing (which has
> been illegal for years) and game shooting (most shot birds get
> away and die slowly; most shooting estates poison any wildlife
> that might predate on their game, and get away with it). No change
> in the law is going to make much direct difference to those. The
> shooting estates are really beyond the law and the only reasonable
> solution would be land confiscation to shut the whole business
> down. Eliminating the US hunting culture would be even harder.
>
> I reckon the country with the greatest per-capita violence against
> the animal kingdom is Malta. That place is just plain sick.
>

I haven't heard what happens in Malta. I don't think I want to.
You're right that animal-cruelty-for-sport is universal. And no,
I sure don't assume that because it's illegal, it doesn't happen.
I'm sure the UK and US can pretty well match each other. Hare
coursing, foxhunting---then there's dogfighting, chickenfighting here.
Not to mention the "legal" animal abuse issues--which includes
rattlesnake hunts, as well as some aspects of rodeo, and others.

I don't think anyone lives in a glass house on this one. We've all
got a long way to go.

Sherry
 >> Stay informed about: Purrs for Tigger, please? 

"CatNipped" <CatNipped.DeleteThis@PossiblePlaces.com> wrote in message
news:5oe4scFm8lt9U1@mid.individual.net...
> "Stormmee" <rgrass.DeleteThis@consolidated.net> wrote in message
> news:5ocpgaFm5065U1@mid.individual.net...
>> this isn't about demonizing, its about the laws that are on the books,
>> and
>> if you read them, nowhere is strict enough to suit me, but if you
>> compare,
>> actual crimes on the books, people charged/convicted and time/sentences
>> they
>> are more civilized. there are lots of wonderful people anywhere you care
>> to
>> look its just that most of the good people are busy trying to make a
>> living
>> instead of trying to change laws. Lee
>
> Sorry, but no, you're wrong. The laws regarding animal abuse in Texas are
> some of the strictest and the punishments the harshest in the world. It's
> a felony here and you can do *hard time* for it. Texas is also one of the
> very few places where a jury can award you monetary damages for "pain and
> suffering" and the emotional harm caused by someone hurting or killing
> your pet (most places will only award the cost of the animal and,
> sometimes, vet bills).
>
> I get tickled when Americans believe so fervently that people in the UK
> are so much more civilized because they talk with a pretty accent and
> stick their pinkies out when drinking tea. I'm not saying that they are
> any *worse* than people in America, but neither are they any better.
> Remember this....
>
> Until quite recently in the UK, fox hunts were legal where hounds hunted
> down and then tore apart foxes and the lead horseman was awarded the fox's
> tail as a trophy.

Excuse me, I mis-spoke - it appears that fox hunting is *still* legal in the
UK. So the country you're praising for being so much more civilized than
the US still allows packs of hounds to chase down for hours and then tear
apart foxes. http://www.mfha.org.uk/


Hugs,

CatNipped

>
> The UK originated the punishment of "hanged, drawn and quartered": [The
> full sentence passed upon those convicted of High Treason up to 1870 was
> as follows : "That you be drawn on a hurdle to the place of execution
> where you shall be hanged by the neck and being alive cut down, your privy
> members shall be cut off and your bowels taken out and burned before you,
> your head severed from your body and your body divided into four quarters
> to be disposed of at the King's pleasure." So not for the faint-hearted
> then!!] It was the US who originated the law against "cruel and unusual
> punishment".
>
> I know there are good laws and bad laws on both sides of "the pond" as
> there are good people and bad people both places too. But please don't
> try to tell me that my country is any *more* savage or brutal than any
> other - it's just *NOT TRUE*. And as an American, you should be ashamed
> of yourself for thinking so!
>
> Hugs,
>
> CatNipped
>
 >> Stay informed about: Purrs for Tigger, please? 

"CatNipped" <CatNipped.DeleteThis@PossiblePlaces.com> wrote in message
news:5oe5i3FmiudjU1@mid.individual.net...
> "CatNipped" <CatNipped.DeleteThis@PossiblePlaces.com> wrote in message
> news:5oe4scFm8lt9U1@mid.individual.net...
>> "Stormmee" <rgrass.DeleteThis@consolidated.net> wrote in message
>> news:5ocpgaFm5065U1@mid.individual.net...
>>> this isn't about demonizing, its about the laws that are on the books,
>>> and
>>> if you read them, nowhere is strict enough to suit me, but if you
>>> compare,
>>> actual crimes on the books, people charged/convicted and time/sentences
>>> they
>>> are more civilized. there are lots of wonderful people anywhere you
>>> care to
>>> look its just that most of the good people are busy trying to make a
>>> living
>>> instead of trying to change laws. Lee
>>
>> Sorry, but no, you're wrong. The laws regarding animal abuse in Texas
>> are some of the strictest and the punishments the harshest in the world.
>> It's a felony here and you can do *hard time* for it. Texas is also one
>> of the very few places where a jury can award you monetary damages for
>> "pain and suffering" and the emotional harm caused by someone hurting or
>> killing your pet (most places will only award the cost of the animal and,
>> sometimes, vet bills).
>>
>> I get tickled when Americans believe so fervently that people in the UK
>> are so much more civilized because they talk with a pretty accent and
>> stick their pinkies out when drinking tea. I'm not saying that they are
>> any *worse* than people in America, but neither are they any better.
>> Remember this....
>>
>> Until quite recently in the UK, fox hunts were legal where hounds hunted
>> down and then tore apart foxes and the lead horseman was awarded the
>> fox's tail as a trophy.
>
> Excuse me, I mis-spoke - it appears that fox hunting is *still* legal in
> the UK. So the country you're praising for being so much more civilized
> than the US still allows packs of hounds to chase down for hours and then
> tear apart foxes. http://www.mfha.org.uk/
>
>
> Hugs,
>
> CatNipped

And, according to the BBC, 200,000 people in the UK participate in fox hunts
where they might get to see a fox ripped limb from limb and disemboweled.

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/uk_news/449139.stm

Hugs,

CatNipped


>> The UK originated the punishment of "hanged, drawn and quartered": [The
>> full sentence passed upon those convicted of High Treason up to 1870 was
>> as follows : "That you be drawn on a hurdle to the place of execution
>> where you shall be hanged by the neck and being alive cut down, your
>> privy members shall be cut off and your bowels taken out and burned
>> before you, your head severed from your body and your body divided into
>> four quarters to be disposed of at the King's pleasure." So not for the
>> faint-hearted then!!] It was the US who originated the law against "cruel
>> and unusual punishment".
>>
>> I know there are good laws and bad laws on both sides of "the pond" as
>> there are good people and bad people both places too. But please don't
>> try to tell me that my country is any *more* savage or brutal than any
>> other - it's just *NOT TRUE*. And as an American, you should be ashamed
>> of yourself for thinking so!
>>
>> Hugs,
>>
>> CatNipped
>>
>
>
 >> Stay informed about: Purrs for Tigger, please? 

On Fri, 26 Oct 2007 08:00:20 -0500, CatNipped wrote:

> "Adrian A" <anca.DeleteThis@bigfoot.com> wrote in message
> news:QJGdnVZj6KMHfLzanZ2dnUVZ8sylnZ2d@brightview.com...
>> [quoted text muted]
>
> Sorry, the site made it look like they were still organizing hunts - I had
> to read much further down that they are only fighting the ban.

And as a point of interest, it was somewhat recently that foxhunting was
banned in the US.

Dan
 >> Stay informed about: Purrs for Tigger, please? 

you obviously haven't read enough on this subject and you have also
obviously chosen to pick and choose rather than reading a full gamut of the
history and laws this discussion is now over for me, don't you ever insult
anyone by telling them what to be ashamed of, this is very offensive to me
since DH is a naturalized citizen and I know what that means, Lee
CatNipped <CatNipped.RemoveThis@PossiblePlaces.com> wrote in message
news:5oe4scFm8lt9U1@mid.individual.net...
> "Stormmee" <rgrass.RemoveThis@consolidated.net> wrote in message
> news:5ocpgaFm5065U1@mid.individual.net...
> > this isn't about demonizing, its about the laws that are on the books,
and
> > if you read them, nowhere is strict enough to suit me, but if you
compare,
> > actual crimes on the books, people charged/convicted and time/sentences
> > they
> > are more civilized. there are lots of wonderful people anywhere you
care
> > to
> > look its just that most of the good people are busy trying to make a
> > living
> > instead of trying to change laws. Lee
>
> Sorry, but no, you're wrong. The laws regarding animal abuse in Texas are
> some of the strictest and the punishments the harshest in the world. It's
a
> felony here and you can do *hard time* for it. Texas is also one of the
> very few places where a jury can award you monetary damages for "pain and
> suffering" and the emotional harm caused by someone hurting or killing
your
> pet (most places will only award the cost of the animal and, sometimes,
vet
> bills).
>
> I get tickled when Americans believe so fervently that people in the UK
are
> so much more civilized because they talk with a pretty accent and stick
> their pinkies out when drinking tea. I'm not saying that they are any
> *worse* than people in America, but neither are they any better. Remember
> this....
>
> Until quite recently in the UK, fox hunts were legal where hounds hunted
> down and then tore apart foxes and the lead horseman was awarded the fox's
> tail as a trophy.
>
> The UK originated the punishment of "hanged, drawn and quartered": [The
> full sentence passed upon those convicted of High Treason up to 1870 was
as
> follows : "That you be drawn on a hurdle to the place of execution where
you
> shall be hanged by the neck and being alive cut down, your privy members
> shall be cut off and your bowels taken out and burned before you, your
head
> severed from your body and your body divided into four quarters to be
> disposed of at the King's pleasure." So not for the faint-hearted then!!]
> It was the US who originated the law against "cruel and unusual
punishment".
>
> I know there are good laws and bad laws on both sides of "the pond" as
there
> are good people and bad people both places too. But please don't try to
> tell me that my country is any *more* savage or brutal than any other -
it's
> just *NOT TRUE*. And as an American, you should be ashamed of yourself
for
> thinking so!
>
> Hugs,
>
> CatNipped
>
>
 >> Stay informed about: Purrs for Tigger, please? 

after the UK I think, Lee
Daniel Mahoney <dan DeleteThis @catfolks.net> wrote in message
news:pan.2007.10.26.13.42.36.562585@catfolks.net...
> On Fri, 26 Oct 2007 08:00:20 -0500, CatNipped wrote:
>
> > "Adrian A" <anca DeleteThis @bigfoot.com> wrote in message
> > news:QJGdnVZj6KMHfLzanZ2dnUVZ8sylnZ2d@brightview.com...
> >> [quoted text muted]
> >
> > Sorry, the site made it look like they were still organizing hunts - I
had
> > to read much further down that they are only fighting the ban.
>
> And as a point of interest, it was somewhat recently that foxhunting was
> banned in the US.
>
> Dan
 >> Stay informed about: Purrs for Tigger, please? 

CatNipped wrote:
>
> Excuse me, I mis-spoke - it appears that fox hunting is *still* legal
> in the UK. So the country you're praising for being so much more
> civilized than the US still allows packs of hounds to chase down for
> hours and then tear apart foxes. http://www.mfha.org.uk/

No, you were right the first time, hunting with dogs *is* illegal in the UK.
--
Adrian (Owned by Snoopy & Bagheera)
Cats leave pawprints on your heart
http://community.webshots.com/user/clowderuk
 >> Stay informed about: Purrs for Tigger, please? 

"Adrian A" <anca.TakeThisOut@bigfoot.com> wrote in message
news:QJGdnVZj6KMHfLzanZ2dnUVZ8sylnZ2d@brightview.com...
> CatNipped wrote:
>>
>> Excuse me, I mis-spoke - it appears that fox hunting is *still* legal
>> in the UK. So the country you're praising for being so much more
>> civilized than the US still allows packs of hounds to chase down for
>> hours and then tear apart foxes. http://www.mfha.org.uk/
>
> No, you were right the first time, hunting with dogs *is* illegal in the
> UK.

Sorry, the site made it look like they were still organizing hunts - I had
to read much further down that they are only fighting the ban.

And Adrian, I'm really *NOT* trying to put down the UK or anyone in it - I
just hate it when *Americans* slander, defame, and spread falsehoods about
*their own* country! The US is not a single whit better than the UK, but
it's not the demon some make it out to be either.

Hugs,

CatNipped


> --
> Adrian (Owned by Snoopy & Bagheera)
> Cats leave pawprints on your heart
> http://community.webshots.com/user/clowderuk
>
 >> Stay informed about: Purrs for Tigger, please? 

not reading enough seems to be a real issue with you, Lee
CatNipped <CatNipped.RemoveThis@PossiblePlaces.com> wrote in message
news:5oe6n6Fm9i2gU1@mid.individual.net...
> "Adrian A" <anca.RemoveThis@bigfoot.com> wrote in message
> news:QJGdnVZj6KMHfLzanZ2dnUVZ8sylnZ2d@brightview.com...
> > CatNipped wrote:
> >>
> >> Excuse me, I mis-spoke - it appears that fox hunting is *still* legal
> >> in the UK. So the country you're praising for being so much more
> >> civilized than the US still allows packs of hounds to chase down for
> >> hours and then tear apart foxes. http://www.mfha.org.uk/
> >
> > No, you were right the first time, hunting with dogs *is* illegal in the
> > UK.
>
> Sorry, the site made it look like they were still organizing hunts - I had
> to read much further down that they are only fighting the ban.
>
> And Adrian, I'm really *NOT* trying to put down the UK or anyone in it - I
> just hate it when *Americans* slander, defame, and spread falsehoods about
> *their own* country! The US is not a single whit better than the UK, but
> it's not the demon some make it out to be either.
>
> Hugs,
>
> CatNipped
>
>
> > --
> > Adrian (Owned by Snoopy & Bagheera)
> > Cats leave pawprints on your heart
> > http://community.webshots.com/user/clowderuk
> >
>
>
 >> Stay informed about: Purrs for Tigger, please? 

"Stormmee" <rgrass RemoveThis @consolidated.net> wrote in message
news:5oeehpFm7m4tU1@mid.individual.net...
> not reading enough seems to be a real issue with you, Lee

And you if you think that there is any place that has a patent on civilized
behavior by all its citizens. And that's real class you've shown to insult
me, immediately say the conversation is over for you, and then continue to
snipe at me in other posts.

If you want to disparage your country and imply we're uncivilized, fine go
ahead - but don't expect me to ignore insults to mine.

Hugs,

CatNipped


> CatNipped <CatNipped RemoveThis @PossiblePlaces.com> wrote in message
> news:5oe6n6Fm9i2gU1@mid.individual.net...
>> "Adrian A" <anca RemoveThis @bigfoot.com> wrote in message
>> news:QJGdnVZj6KMHfLzanZ2dnUVZ8sylnZ2d@brightview.com...
>> > CatNipped wrote:
>> >>
>> >> Excuse me, I mis-spoke - it appears that fox hunting is *still* legal
>> >> in the UK. So the country you're praising for being so much more
>> >> civilized than the US still allows packs of hounds to chase down for
>> >> hours and then tear apart foxes. http://www.mfha.org.uk/
>> >
>> > No, you were right the first time, hunting with dogs *is* illegal in
>> > the
>> > UK.
>>
>> Sorry, the site made it look like they were still organizing hunts - I
>> had
>> to read much further down that they are only fighting the ban.
>>
>> And Adrian, I'm really *NOT* trying to put down the UK or anyone in it -
>> I
>> just hate it when *Americans* slander, defame, and spread falsehoods
>> about
>> *their own* country! The US is not a single whit better than the UK, but
>> it's not the demon some make it out to be either.
>>
>> Hugs,
>>
>> CatNipped
>>
>>
>> > --
>> > Adrian (Owned by Snoopy & Bagheera)
>> > Cats leave pawprints on your heart
>> > http://community.webshots.com/user/clowderuk
>> >
>>
>>
>
>
 >> Stay informed about: Purrs for Tigger, please? 

CatNipped wrote:
>
> And, according to the BBC, 200,000 people in the UK participate in
> fox hunts where they might get to see a fox ripped limb from limb and
> disemboweled.
> http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/uk_news/449139.stm

That was nearly 8 years ago, once again you have your facts wrong.
--
Adrian (Owned by Snoopy & Bagheera)
Cats leave pawprints on your heart
http://community.webshots.com/user/clowderuk
 >> Stay informed about: Purrs for Tigger, please?