Help End the Cruel Harp Seal Hunt

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"Mark Dawson" <markdawson.RemoveThis@email.com> wrote in message
news:MPG.205ddd12595593089897ff@news.datemas.de...
> Seals are vicious, sadistic fish killers. They're the enemy.

But seals are so cute with those big round eyes and all. They're really
just little people in fur coats. Fish are slimy, cold-blooded creatures
that aren't very huggable. It's hard to feel compassion for a fish because
they just aren't like us. That's how the anthropomorphizing ARAs develop
their hierarchy of subjects worthy of rights. Typically, they must be
mammalian and the higher they are in the food chain the better. Walt Disney
characters seems to be the ARA guidebook for determining the hierarchy of
worthiness.
 >> Stay informed about: Help End the Cruel Harp Seal Hunt 

"Nobody" <not.DeleteThis@home.anymore> wrote in message news:Xns98F0714AFDC911v2rt@204.153.245.131...
> pearl wrote:
...
> >> > Projection is achieved
> >> > through blame, criticism and allegation; once you realise this,
> >> > every criticism, allegation etc that the bully makes about
> >> > their target is actually an admission or revelation about
> >> > themselves.
> >>
> >> Nice rant but not really applicable here.
> >
> > In many more ways than one.
>
> To YOU, perhaps.

'Opinion polls consistently show a clear majority of Canadians
oppose the commercial seal hunt. Nearly 70 percent of Canadians
... oppose the seal hunt outright, with even higher numbers against
specific, inherent aspects of the hunt - such as the killing of seal
pups. (Environics Research, 2005).

In recent months, domestic and international opposition to the
commercial seal hunt has steadily gained momentum as images
of extreme cruelty at the hunt - including the skinning of live
animals - have been broadcast around the world. This
opposition has resulted in effective consumer action campaigns
targeting Canada's seafood and tourism industries.
....'
http://www.archalifax.com/resources/Why%20the%20Government%20of%20Cana...20suppo

> >> I HAVE done research and
> >> THAT is why I can honestly say what I do. YOU, on the other
> >> hand, recite someone else's propaganda.
> >
> > Let's see your data for seal meat exports then.
>
> As I said before, I HAVE done the research. You, it seems, haven't
> or you wouldn't ask such a stupid question. I feel sorry for your
> ignorance so here is a link to get you started:
> http://strategis.ic.gc.ca/sc_mrkti/tdst/tdo/tdo.php?
> There is also some interesting information on just which countries
> are buying much of the fur.
>
> Post back when you have some valid information.

Still waiting....
 >> Stay informed about: Help End the Cruel Harp Seal Hunt 

"Nobody" <not.DeleteThis@home.anymore> wrote in message news:Xns98F07512234E1v2rt@204.153.245.131...
> pearl wrote:
>
>
> > The seals do not belong to you.
>
> You think that they belong to you?

They belong to no one. You cannot truthfully own other beings.

> You aren't anywhere near Canada yet
> you think it is YOUR duty to tell us how to manage OUR resources.

Wildlife exists for its own ends, not yours, and you NEED telling..

> No
> wonder kooks like yourself have little credibility. You can't manage
> your own affairs but feel the need to manage the affairs of everyone
> else.

'Opinion polls consistently show a clear majority of Canadians
oppose the commercial seal hunt. Nearly 70 percent of Canadians
... oppose the seal hunt outright, with even higher numbers against
specific, inherent aspects of the hunt - such as the killing of seal
pups. (Environics Research, 2005).

In recent months, domestic and international opposition to the
commercial seal hunt has steadily gained momentum as images
of extreme cruelty at the hunt - including the skinning of live
animals - have been broadcast around the world. This
opposition has resulted in effective consumer action campaigns
targeting Canada's seafood and tourism industries.

In light of the high level of public opposition, and the potential
threat to other industries, many people ask why the Canadian
government continues to defend and support the seal hunt.
The answer is rooted in a history of fisheries mismanagement
and the current political situation in Canada.

Seals - an ideal scapegoat

In the 1950s and 60s, industrial fishing fleets decimated fish
stocks off Canada's East Coast, hauling up in one hour twice
the amount of fish a sixteenth century ship would take an
entire season to catch. By the 1970s, it was clear the northern
cod population was on the brink of collapse.

At the end of the same two decades, the harp seal population
was also in a steep decline as a result of massive over-hunting.
By 1974, senior Canadian government scientists were so
concerned they warned that the harp seal population could be
lost forever in the absence of a 10 year moratorium on sealing.

The world acted to save the seals. In 1983, responding to
intense public pressure, the European Union stepped in and
banned the import of whitecoat and blueback sealskins - the
main products of the commercial seal hunt at the time. Since
Europe was the hunt's primary market, kill levels dramatically
declined and the harp seal population slowly began to recover.

"All scientific efforts to find an effect of seal predation on
Canadian groundfish stocks have failed to show any impact.
Overfishing remains the only scientifically demonstrated
conservation problem related to fish stock collapse."

- From a petition signed by 97 scientists from 15 countries
at the 11th Biennial Conference on the Biology of Marine
Mammals, Dec.1995

The cod were not as lucky. In the 1970s, Canada established a
'200 mile limit' to protect fish stocks from foreign fishing fleets.
But instead of using the new law to allow stocks to rebuild,
Canadian fishing companies dramatically increased their own
take. Ignoring and suppressing advice from its own scientists,
Canada's Department of Fisheries and Oceans (DFO) authorized
highly unsustainable quotas throughout the 1970s and 80s. By
the 1990s, with northern cod stocks at only one percent of their
historic levels, it was clear decades of over-fishing had resulted
in an ecological catastrophe. In 1992, a moratorium was declared
on cod fishing.

As 40,000 Atlantic Canadians lost a primary source of income,
the DFO attempted to blame factors beyond their control. And
despite a consensus in the scientific community to the contrary,
seal predation on cod was at the top of their list. Given the
residual anger about the EU sealskin ban, the failure of the cod
stocks to recover, and the prevalent myth that seals harm fish
stocks, seals were a perfect scapegoat for the dwindling fish
stocks. Government and independent scientists argued that
only 3 percent of a harp seal's diet consists of northern cod,
and that harp seals also consume many significant cod predators.
But their advice went unheard, and calls for a seal cull echoed
loudly through Eastern Canada and within the DFO bureaucracy
itself.

Political background
........
http://www.archalifax.com/resources/Why%20the%20Government%20of%20Cana...20suppo

> > Put your own house in order.
>
> You first.

Get real.
 >> Stay informed about: Help End the Cruel Harp Seal Hunt 

"Chom Noamsky" <e DeleteThis @t.me> wrote in message news:NxWIh.75335$cE3.55818@edtnps89...
> "pearl" <tea DeleteThis @signguestbook.ie> wrote in message
> news:et0rna$phc$1@reader01.news.esat.net...
>
> > The seals do not belong to you. Put your own house in order.
>
> Yes they do.

No, they do not, regardless of what you have decided, to suit you.

> All animals that reside within the territorial waters and
> boundaries of Canada belong to Canadians, and can be used as a common
> resource in any way Canadians see fit.
>
> That's the way the real world works, get over it.
 >> Stay informed about: Help End the Cruel Harp Seal Hunt 

"Chom Noamsky" <e DeleteThis @t.me> wrote in message news:lnWIh.75072$cE3.59687@edtnps89...
> "pearl" <tea DeleteThis @signguestbook.ie> wrote in message
> news:et0rqr$phu$1@reader01.news.esat.net...
>
> > I care about the seals and the environment. Duh.
>
> Harp Seals are not in any great danger of extinction, far from it, the
> populations are quite healthy and have been stable for years.

'While the harp seal is not on Canada's species at risk list, it is
unlikely that the population can continue to withstand the current
levels of exploitation.

The last time this many seals were killed was in the 50's and 60's
(before the hunt was managed by the Canadian government)
when nearly 2/3 of the population was wiped out. By the mid 70's,
senior scientists employed by the Canadian government
recommended the commercial hunt be suspended for at least ten
years to allow the troubled population to recover.

Unlike the walrus, pilot whale, polar bear, wolf, Labrador duck
and Eskimo Curlew that were commercially exploited to extinction
in Atlantic Canada years ago, the future of Canada's harp and
hooded seal population is now also jeopardized by global warming.
To raise their pups, these seals are dependant on ice coverage,
which has declined significantly over the years. The decline in
sea ice could lead to a dramatic increase in seal mortality rates.

Seals are also threatened by unsustainable fishing practices which
are not only depleting their food sources but entangle them in
non-selective nets and trawls.Thousands of seals are caught every
year as bycatch in gillnets.

It is naïve to think Canadian seal populations are doing just fine
when they have been subjected to the largest cull in half a century
as well as the implications of a degraded marine ecosystem due
to over-fishing, pollution and climate change.
....'
http://www.savecanadianseals.org/huntfacts.html

> Actually, if you cared about the environment you would support the seal
> hunt. People need to make a living, if they aren't doing so on the water
> then they are doing so on the land. That could be logging, farming,
> ranching, mining, manufacturing, etc. All of these industries create loss
> of habitat for wild animals. Sealing creates no such loss of habitat.
> Controlling the seal population will also allow the cod fishery to recover
> faster,

"Those who support the theory that seals are destroying the
fish are only exposing their ignorance of ecological systems.
The reasoning that less seals will result in more fish or that more
seals will deplete existing fish populations is an unscientific
belief because it is a belief not backed by observation or data.

Seals are essential element in maintaining a state of ecological
stability. The ocean is a complex, living environment that has
evolved since the beginning of the planet. In our present state
of evolution, the natural world we live in has found a key role
for marine mammals in marine habitats. The issue of harp seals
cannot be seperated from the issue of the long-term future
health of the oceans.
...
The life that thrives in the oceans has a critical influence on the
overall health of the ocean system. The great herds of seals
are a life force whose influence on the health of the ocean can
be recognized once the complexities of the food chain are
investigated and understood.

When harp seals eat in herds, they return massive amounts of
nutrients in the form of fecal material, which feeds the plankton,
which feed the fish, which in turn feed the seals. The removal
of this nutrient base would be critical to the health of plankton
and fish populations.

The migrating seal herds, and other marine mammals, move
nutrient wealth in a way no other force can: in giant north-
south loops and from great depths to the surface. By going
through regular periods of gorging and feasting, seals provide
large amounts of nutrients at key times of the year. The
combination of the seal supplied nutrients in the area where
the Labrador Current meets the Gulf Stream of Mexico is
responsible for the great fish grounds of the Grand Banks.
Reference to the logs of captain Jacques Cartier, Samuel de
Champlain, and John Cabot illustrate that at the time of the
greatest number of seals prior to European exploitation, the
fish were so abundant that Cabot described the Grand Banks
as "so swarming with fish that they could be taken but in
baskets let down with a stone."

Plankton, the smallest animals in the ocean, require organic
matter and sunlight to grow. Once the sun reaches a high
enough point in the sky in the northern lattitudes so that
sufficient sunlight is available to the plankton, the seals arrive
and begin to eat and defacate, releasing the needed supply
of nutrients. Plankton cannot eat fish, but they can consume
fecal material as it is broken down into nutrients. The plankton
then provides for krill and up the food chain through the fish
and back to the seal.

An analogy that helps to understand the role of the seal
herds in the ocean is that of trees in a forest. A healthy forest
can be viewed as being dependent on a healthy soil. The soil
is made up of minerals that come from rock, and organic
material from trees. Without the rocks or the trees there
would be soil and no forest. The impact of clear-cuts is well
known. Once the trees are taken away, a desert is left behind.
In a similiar manner, taking seals out of the ocean environment
takes away an important source of organic material to the
plankton, and thus leaves a relatively sterile environment
behind.
...
http://www.harpseals.org/hunt/ecosystem.html

>which in turn will reduce the economic dependency on sealing.

'For reasons known only to itself, the Canadian government
subsidizes the seal hunt. According to reports from the Canadian
Institute for Business and the Environment, more than $20 million
in subsidies were provided to the sealing industry between 1995
and 2001. Those subsidies came from entities such as the Atlantic
Canada Opportunities Agency, Human Resources Development
Council, and Canada Economic Development-Quebec. These
subsidies take a variety of forms, including funding the salaries
for seal processing plant workers, market research and
development trips, and capital acquisitions for processing plants.
...'
http://www.hsus.org/marine_mammals/protect_seals/canadas_unsustainable...03_2006

> If you really cared about seals and the environment, you would promote the
> seal hunt.

'A commercial fisherman in New South Wales applied for a licence in
January 2000 to shoot Australian fur seals and New Zealand fur seals
sharing his fishing grounds around Montague Island. Officials said
however that there was very little chance of the licence being granted
due to the seals' worth to the local economy through ecotourism, ..'
http://www.pinnipeds.org/species/saausfur.htm

''Eco-tourism' is growing rapidly in Shetland as more and more
travellers discover the natural wonders on Britain's northern
doorstep. Several companies now offer package tours taking in
the nature reserves and other wildlife sites:
.....
For guaranteed, close-up views of both species of British seals,
Shetland is as good as it gets.
...
http://www.visitshetland.com/attractions_and_activities/natural/eco-tourism/

'Baikal Seals. Ecotourism on the Lake Baikal in Siberia
http://firntravel.ru/nerpa/en/index.htm

'Cruising in the Antarctic. World's best responsible & ecotourism .
...World's best responsible & ecotourism holidays. ... the land to
seals and colonies of penguins and the skies to a host of birdlife. ...
www.responsibletravel.com/Trip/Trip100603.htm

......
 >> Stay informed about: Help End the Cruel Harp Seal Hunt 

<10x@teluös.net> wrote in message news:i568v2dkts43rgml5uh80tpk5h96bn6ma6@4ax.com...
> On Sun, 11 Mar 2007 12:23:15 -0000, "pearl" <tea.TakeThisOut@signguestbook.ie>
> wrote:
>
> >
> >> I HAVE done research and
> >> THAT is why I can honestly say what I do. YOU, on the other hand,
> >> recite someone else's propaganda.
> >
> >Let's see your data for seal meat exports then.
>
> It isn't about seal meat exports. It is about the local folks being
> able to supliment their diet with seal meat and not have to be
> dependant on farmers who have destroyed wildlife habitat for their
> food.

'Most of the meat is wasted and left on the ice. Some if it is
sold to fur farms and some is ground up into animal feed. A
few thousand seal flippers are sold for human consumption in
Newfoundland. There is also a growing black market demand
for the seal penis bone in the Far East as some sort of voodoo
quack remedy for impotence.
....
There are few indigenous peoples involved in the commercial
seal "hunt". Inuit or Native people in the North hunt mostly in
the arctic and primarily ringed seals. Most of the sealers in the
Gulf of St.Lawrence are residents of the Magdalen Islands
of Quebec. These are French speaking people. Most of the
sealers of the Newfoundland Front are descendents of the
European immigrants.

There are about 4500 Inuit in Newfoundland. However, the
original Newfoundlanders, the Beothuk, were driven into
extinction by the European immigrants. The last member of
the Beothuk nation died in 1912. The Newfoundlanders had
a bounty on the Beothuk and most were slain by MicMac
Indian bounty hunters from New Brunswick and Quebec.
Newfoundlanders also drove the Newfoundland wolf, the
walrus, and the Labrador duck to extinction and extirpated the
polar bear, and the pilot whale from Newfoundland territory....
....'
http://www.harpseals.org/hunt/faqs.html

> Harvesting wildlife is the least environmentally damaging way to get
> food. The habitat remains, a core breeding population remains, the
> habitat is unchanged, and the remaining population is genetically
> selected to evade capture.
> COntrast that with the slash, burn, and monoculture methods of
> vegetable farming. The pesticides, the herbicides, the fertilizer.
>
> ANd don't pull this "organic farming" BS. If pesticides, herbicides,
> and fertilzers were not used there would be enough crop failures
> coupled with reduced crop production to make sure that vegitables were
> a scarce commodity. Organic farms only exist because their neighbors
> are NOT organic farmers and there is a pesticide and herbicide barrier
> around most organic farms.

'Cornell Ph.D. student works the land by hand at Bison Ridge
Farming in harmony with nature

By Lauren Cahoon
Special to The Journal
August 4, 2006

VAN ETTEN - What if every farmer decided to turn off his machinery and
go without fossil fuels once and for all? And along with that, what if they
all stopped putting pesticides, herbicides and chemical fertilizers on
their fields?

What if every gardener stopped pulling out their weeds and tilling their
soil? Chaos, you say? Mass shortages in crops and foods, gardens choked
with weeds? Perhaps so. But Rob Young, a Ph.D. student and lecturer at
Cornell University, has done all of the above with his small farm - and
the business, like the crops, is growing.

"We just got a new client who's running a restaurant in one of the local
towns - we brought them some of our lettuce and they went crazy over it
..... our lettuce just knocked them over, it's so good."

Young's Bison Ridge farm, located in Van Etten, runs almost completely
without the use of fossil fuels, fossil fuel-derived fertilizers, or pesticides.

The land has been farmed since the 1850s. Young and his wife, Katharine,
purchased the farm in 1989. Before that, Young worked as the Sustainable
Business Director for New Jersey governor Christine Todd Whitman.
When he discovered Bison Ridge, Young started working the land even
while he was still living in New Jersey. Eventually, Young and his wife
moved to the Ithaca area so they could start their graduate program at
Cornell.

"We started doing a little gardening... then added more and more fields
..... at first, we just wanted it to be an organic farm" Rob explained.
Running an organic farm is admirable enough, but at some point, Young
took it a step farther.

"I had an epiphany," he said. "I was transplanting beets after a spring
rain, and I noticed how the land felt all hot and sticky - almost like
when you wipe out on your bike and you get a brush burn. I know it sounds
cheesy, but I could feel how that (farmed) land had gotten a 'brush burn'
when it was cleared and plowed.

"That's when I decided, I want to work with this land rather than against it."

After that, Young started throwing common farming practices out the
window. He reduced weeding, adding copious amounts of composted
mulch instead and, because of the life teeming in the healthy soils and fields
around the farm, Young lets natural predators get rid of any insect pests.

No mechanized machinery is used except for the primary plowing of new
fields. In fact, except for driving to and from the farm (in a hybrid car,
no less), no fossil fuels are used in any part of production. Irrigation
of crops is either gravity-fed from an old stone well dug in the 1800s or
through pumps driven by solar energy. Super-rich compost is used on
all of the crops along with clover, which fixes nitrogen and adds organic
matter to the soil. Crops are grown in multi-species patches, to mimic
natural communities (insect pests wreak less havoc when they're faced
with diverse types of vegetation).

In addition, the farm has a large greenhouse where most of the crops are
grown as seedlings during the late winter/early spring to get a head
start. The entire structure is heated by a huge bank of compost, whose
microbial activity keeps the growing beds at a toasty 70 degrees. During
the spring and summer, most of the plants are grown in outdoor raised
beds - which yield about three times as much per square meter as a regular
field.

"When people visit the farm, they comment on how we're not using a lot
of the land - they don't realize we're producing triple the amount of crops
from less land," Young said. "It is labor intensive, but you can target
your fertility management, and the produce is so good."

Young's passion for earth-friendly farming has proved to be infectious.
As a student, teaching assistant and teacher at Cornell, Young has had the
chance to tell many people in the community about Bison Ridge, which
is how Marion Dixon, a graduate student in developmental sociology, got
involved with the whole endeavor.

"I had wanted to farm forever - and was always telling myself, 'I'll do it
when I'm not in school,'" she said. But when she heard Young give a
speech about recycling and sustainable living at her dining hall, she knew
she had found her chance to actually get involved.

Dixon and Young now work the farm cooperatively, each contributing
their time and effort into the land.

"I've had a lot of ideas," Young said, "but the work has been done by a
lot of people - it's a community of people who have made his happen."

He said that because of Dixon's input, they now have a new way of
planting lettuce that has doubled production.

Although Young and Dixon are the only ones currently running the farm,
during the summer there are always several people who contribute, from
undergrads to graduate students to local people in the community - all
united by a common desire to work with the land.

"There's personal satisfaction in working the soil, being on the land and
outdoors," Dixon said. "You get to work out, and get that sense of
community - plus there's the quality, healthy food. ... It's about believing
in a localized economy, believing in production that's ecologically and
community-based."

The combination of working with the earth's natural systems and
community involvement has paid off. Over the course of several seasons,
Bison Ridge has grown a variety of vegetables, maple syrup, wheat as well
as eggs from free-range chickens. They have a range of clients, including a
supermarket and several restaurants, and have delivered produce to many
families in CSA (Community Sponsored Agriculture) programs.

Although small, Bison Ridge Farm has prospered due to its independence
from increasingly expensive fossil fuel. Young said that, since little if any
of their revenue is spent on gas, advertising or transportation, it makes
the food affordable to low-income people, another goal that Young and
Dixon are shooting for with their farming.

Although Young and Dixon are happy about the monetary gains the farm is
producing, they have the most passion and enthusiasm for the less tangible
goods the farm provides.

"It's such a delight to work with," Dixon said. "You feel alive when you're
there."

http://www.theithacajournal.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article%3FAID%3D/2006080...EWS01/6
 >> Stay informed about: Help End the Cruel Harp Seal Hunt 

<10x@teluös.net> wrote in message news:hs58v25csg5buka3gca337btdtom9hqdmk@4ax.com...
> On Sun, 11 Mar 2007 12:13:58 -0000, "pearl" <tea.TakeThisOut@signguestbook.ie>
> wrote:
>
> >"Chom Noamsky" <e.TakeThisOut@t.me> wrote in message news:poKIh.62334$Du6.57729@edtnps82...
> >> "pearl" <tea.TakeThisOut@signguestbook.ie> wrote in message
> >> news:esvh94$7h0$1@reader01.news.esat.net...
> >> > "Chom Noamsky" <e.TakeThisOut@t.me> wrote in message
> >> > news:_IHIh.62302$Du6.38382@edtnps82...
> >> >> > "pearl" <tea.TakeThisOut@signguestbook.ie> wrote in message
> >> >> > news:esvf0i$6lg$1@reader01.news.esat.net...
> >> >
> >> >> > 'Bullies project their inadequacies, shortcomings, behaviours
> >> >> > etc on to other people to avoid facing up to their inadequacy
> >> >> > and doing something about it (learning about oneself can be
> >> >> > painful), and to distract and divert attention away from
> >> >> > themselves and their inadequacies. Projection is achieved
> >> >> > through blame, criticism and allegation; once you realise this,
> >> >> > every criticism, allegation etc that the bully makes about their
> >> >> > target is actually an admission or revelation about themselves.
> >> >>
> >> >> That was a great general description of PETA and its membership.
> >> >
> >> > You're still doing it..
> >>
> >> I'd have to say the role of bully is being played by PETA. It's really none
> >> of PETA's business (headquartered in the US) to interfere in the affairs of
> >> the sovereign nation of Canada. If anyone finds sealing objectionable,
> >> simply refrain from buying the products. If there wasn't any market for
> >> seal products there wouldnt be a hunt, except perhaps a cull to help
> >> Canada's over exploited cod fishery to recover.
> >
> >The seals do not belong to you. Put your own house in order.
>
> Nor do the seals belong to you or any animal rights group.
> The seals are there for those that need to eat them. That includes
> marine predators, and non marine predators. They are part of the food
> chain. You are claiming that man can not eat them but killer whales,
> sharks, and polar bears can? You are claiming that these wild
> predators are some how more mercifull than man?

Stop pretending that this slaughter is about real need and survival.
 >> Stay informed about: Help End the Cruel Harp Seal Hunt 

<10x@teluös.net> wrote in message news:f168v2lkmj6sog2gnqbaqagt9j29hqak85@4ax.com...
> On Sun, 11 Mar 2007 12:15:51 -0000, "pearl" <tea.RemoveThis@signguestbook.ie>
> wrote:
>
> >"Nobody" <not.RemoveThis@home.anymore> wrote in message news:Xns98EFCFF5C75ED1v2rt@204.153.245.131...
> >> Chom Noamsky wrote:
> >>
> >> > "pearl" <tea.RemoveThis@signguestbook.ie> wrote in message
> >> > news:esvh94$7h0$1@reader01.news.esat.net...
> >> >> "Chom Noamsky" <e.RemoveThis@t.me> wrote in message
> >> >> news:_IHIh.62302$Du6.38382@edtnps82...
> >> >>> > "pearl" <tea.RemoveThis@signguestbook.ie> wrote in message
> >> >>> > news:esvf0i$6lg$1@reader01.news.esat.net...
> >> >>
> >> >>> > 'Bullies project their inadequacies, shortcomings, behaviours
> >> >>> > etc on to other people to avoid facing up to their inadequacy
> >> >>> > and doing something about it (learning about oneself can be
> >> >>> > painful), and to distract and divert attention away from
> >> >>> > themselves and their inadequacies. Projection is achieved
> >> >>> > through blame, criticism and allegation; once you realise
> >> >>> > this, every criticism, allegation etc that the bully makes
> >> >>> > about their target is actually an admission or revelation
> >> >>> > about themselves.
> >> >>>
> >> >>> That was a great general description of PETA and its membership.
> >> >>
> >> >> You're still doing it..
> >> >
> >> > I'd have to say the role of bully is being played by PETA. It's
> >> > really none of PETA's business (headquartered in the US) to
> >> > interfere in the affairs of the sovereign nation of Canada. If
> >> > anyone finds sealing objectionable, simply refrain from buying the
> >> > products. If there wasn't any market for seal products there
> >> > wouldnt be a hunt, except perhaps a cull to help Canada's over
> >> > exploited cod fishery to recover.
> >>
> >> Well said. I wonder what interest 'pearl' from the UK actually has
> >> in the issue. At least Karen Gordon is Canadian.
> >
> >I care about the seals and the environment. Duh.
>
> You probably do care about seals and the environment.
>
> Sadly you are a vegetarian. The demand by folks who eat ceral crops
> and vegetables has decimated wildlife habitat. The energy and water
> used for irrigation alone is a major environmental disaster.
> Maybe you are part of the problem?

'Livestock a major threat to environment
...
Livestock now use 30 percent of the earth's entire land surface, mostly
permanent pasture but also including 33 percent of the global arable land
used to producing feed for livestock, the report notes. As forests are
cleared to create new pastures, it is a major driver of deforestation,
especially in Latin America where, for example, some 70 percent of
former forests in the Amazon have been turned over to grazing.

Land and water

At the same time herds cause wide-scale land degradation, with about
20 percent of pastures considered as degraded through overgrazing,
compaction and erosion. This figure is even higher in the drylands
where inappropriate policies and inadequate livestock management
contribute to advancing desertification.

The livestock business is among the most damaging sectors to the
earth's increasingly scarce water resources, contributing among other
things to water pollution, euthropication and the degeneration of coral
reefs. The major polluting agents are animal wastes, antibiotics and
hormones, chemicals from tanneries, fertilizers and the pesticides used
to spray feed crops. Widespread overgrazing disturbs water cycles,
reducing replenishment of above and below ground water resources.
Significant amounts of water are withdrawn for the production of feed.

Livestock are estimated to be the main inland source of phosphorous
and nitrogen contamination of the South China Sea, contributing to
biodiversity loss in marine ecosystems.

Meat and dairy animals now account for about 20 percent of all
terrestrial animal biomass. Livestock's presence in vast tracts of land
and its demand for feed crops also contribute to biodiversity loss;
15 out of 24 important ecosystem services are assessed as in decline,
with livestock identified as a culprit.
....
http://www.fao.org/newsroom/en/news/2006/1000448/index.html

Impact of livestock grazing on wildlife and habitat worldwide:
http://www.wasteofthewest.com/Chapter6.html

"global arable land" = "present cropland"..

From Technological Trajectories and the Human Environment.
1997. Pp. 56-73. Washington, DC: National Academy Press.
"How Much Land Can Ten Billion People Spare for Nature?"..

'By eating different species of crops and a more or less vegetarian
diet people can change the number that a plot can feed. And large
numbers of people do change their diets. The calories and protein
available from present cropland could provide a vegetarian diet to
ten billion people. A diet requiring food and feed totaling 6,000
calories daily for ten billion people, however, would overwhelm
the capability of present agriculture on present cropland. The
global totals of sun, CO2, fertilizer, and even water could produce
far more food than what ten billion people need.
...'
http://books.nap.edu/openbook.php?record_id=4767&page=56
 >> Stay informed about: Help End the Cruel Harp Seal Hunt 

<10x@teluös.net> wrote in message news:8h58v2d61s7v55t6n5tb0rf1bi88c0odgi@4ax.com...
> On Sun, 11 Mar 2007 12:08:35 -0000, "pearl" <tea.RemoveThis@signguestbook.ie>
> wrote:
>
> >"Chom Noamsky" <e.RemoveThis@t.me> wrote in message news:H2LIh.62343$Du6.31635@edtnps82...
> >> "pearl" <tea.RemoveThis@signguestbook.ie> wrote in message
> >> news:esvdt7$67m$2@reader01.news.esat.net...
> >>
> >> > Humans are not a naturally carnivorous species.
> >>
> >> Humans are naturally omnivores (both herbivore and carnivore). That can be
> >> proven by simply examining our teeth.
> >
> >See my reply to Nobody.
> >
> >> >> And how would Pearl suggest the Inuit grow cereal crops and
> >> >> vegetables? OR is global warming going to allow them to do that?
> >> >
> >> > These seals are not being killed for meat.
> >>
> >> There is still a market for seal meat but it isn't the primary market.
> >
> >Again, show us data to support your claim.
>
> You want the menu for an outport restraunt in Newfoundland?
> You have never had seal flipper soup?

'Most of the meat is wasted and left on the ice. Some if it is
sold to fur farms and some is ground up into animal feed. A
few thousand seal flippers are sold for human consumption in
Newfoundland. There is also a growing black market demand
for the seal penis bone in the Far East as some sort of voodoo
quack remedy for impotence.
....
There are few indigenous peoples involved in the commercial
seal "hunt". Inuit or Native people in the North hunt mostly in
the arctic and primarily ringed seals. Most of the sealers in the
Gulf of St.Lawrence are residents of the Magdalen Islands
of Quebec. These are French speaking people. Most of the
sealers of the Newfoundland Front are descendents of the
European immigrants.

There are about 4500 Inuit in Newfoundland. However, the
original Newfoundlanders, the Beothuk, were driven into
extinction by the European immigrants. The last member of
the Beothuk nation died in 1912. The Newfoundlanders had
a bounty on the Beothuk and most were slain by MicMac
Indian bounty hunters from New Brunswick and Quebec.
Newfoundlanders also drove the Newfoundland wolf, the
walrus, and the Labrador duck to extinction and extirpated the
polar bear, and the pilot whale from Newfoundland territory....
....'
http://www.harpseals.org/hunt/faqs.html

> You should travel to China and take a close look at the menus there.
> If it walks, swims, crawls, or is breathing, it just might be a menu
> item.

'Tu Quoque - Two Wrongs Make a Right

Description: Two wrongs never add up to a right; you cannot right
a wrong by applying yet another wrong. Such a fallacy is a misplaced
appeal to consistency. It is a fallacy because it makes no attempt to
deal with the subject under discussion.

http://education.gsu.edu/spehar/FOCUS/EdPsy/misc/Fallacies.htm
 >> Stay informed about: Help End the Cruel Harp Seal Hunt 

<10x@teluös.net> wrote in message news:im58v21keb9fhg0f0s1334e77kglgu4gev@4ax.com...
> On Sun, 11 Mar 2007 12:07:11 -0000, "pearl" <tea.RemoveThis@signguestbook.ie>
> wrote:
>
> >'Well-planned vegan and other types of vegetarian diets are appropriate
> >for all stages of the lifecycle, including during pregnancy, lactation,
> >infancy, childhood and adolescence. Appropriately planned vegetarian
> >diets are healthful, nutritionally adequate and provide health benefits in
> >the prevention and treatment of certain diseases.' These 'certain
> >diseases' are the killer epidemics of today - heart disease, strokes,
> >cancers, diabetes etc.
> >
> >This is the view of the world's most prestigious health advisory body,
> >the American Dietetic Association and Dietitians of Canada, after a
> >review of world literature. It is backed up by the British Medical
> >Association:
> >
> >'Vegetarians have lower rates of obesity, coronary heart disease,
> >high blood pressure, large bowel disorders, cancers and gall stones.'
> >...'
> >http://www.vegetarian.org.uk/mediareleases/050221.html
>
>
> You should see the millions of hectares stolen from wildlife habitat
> so that farmers can grow food for folks who eat cerial crops and
> vegetables. All those animals that used that habitat are now shut out
> and starving.
> Not to mention all of the fertilizers, herbicides, and pestiticides
> farmers use to maximize the crops they grow to sell to vegetarians.
> All that stuff is poisoning the earth. Give me pristine wilderness,
> grubbing for roots, and eating small (and large) mammals and fish that
> I catch my self. I'm really into organic....

Non sequitur. As you've mentioned it, though..

'Livestock a major threat to environment
...
Livestock now use 30 percent of the earth's entire land surface, mostly
permanent pasture but also including 33 percent of the global arable land
used to producing feed for livestock, the report notes. As forests are
cleared to create new pastures, it is a major driver of deforestation,
especially in Latin America where, for example, some 70 percent of
former forests in the Amazon have been turned over to grazing.

Land and water

At the same time herds cause wide-scale land degradation, with about
20 percent of pastures considered as degraded through overgrazing,
compaction and erosion. This figure is even higher in the drylands
where inappropriate policies and inadequate livestock management
contribute to advancing desertification.

The livestock business is among the most damaging sectors to the
earth's increasingly scarce water resources, contributing among other
things to water pollution, euthropication and the degeneration of coral
reefs. The major polluting agents are animal wastes, antibiotics and
hormones, chemicals from tanneries, fertilizers and the pesticides used
to spray feed crops. Widespread overgrazing disturbs water cycles,
reducing replenishment of above and below ground water resources.
Significant amounts of water are withdrawn for the production of feed.

Livestock are estimated to be the main inland source of phosphorous
and nitrogen contamination of the South China Sea, contributing to
biodiversity loss in marine ecosystems.

Meat and dairy animals now account for about 20 percent of all
terrestrial animal biomass. Livestock's presence in vast tracts of land
and its demand for feed crops also contribute to biodiversity loss;
15 out of 24 important ecosystem services are assessed as in decline,
with livestock identified as a culprit.
....
http://www.fao.org/newsroom/en/news/2006/1000448/index.html

Impact of livestock grazing on wildlife and habitat worldwide:
http://www.wasteofthewest.com/Chapter6.html

"global arable land" = "present cropland"..

From Technological Trajectories and the Human Environment.
1997. Pp. 56-73. Washington, DC: National Academy Press.
"How Much Land Can Ten Billion People Spare for Nature?"..

'By eating different species of crops and a more or less vegetarian
diet people can change the number that a plot can feed. And large
numbers of people do change their diets. The calories and protein
available from present cropland could provide a vegetarian diet to
ten billion people. A diet requiring food and feed totaling 6,000
calories daily for ten billion people, however, would overwhelm
the capability of present agriculture on present cropland. The
global totals of sun, CO2, fertilizer, and even water could produce
far more food than what ten billion people need.
...'
http://books.nap.edu/openbook.php?record_id=4767&page=56
 >> Stay informed about: Help End the Cruel Harp Seal Hunt